Talk:Paid ministry

Levitical priests

I'm sure I can find more passages showing they received payment. — 04:26, 12 August 2009 (UTC)

Filthy lucre

Should probably add a section about this. — 04:26, 12 August 2009 (UTC)

2 Ki 5; 1 Tim 3:3, 8; Titus 1:7, 11; 1 Pet 5:2; and see D&C 42:70-73 — 15:38, 14 August 2009 (UTC)

Paul did receive wages for preaching

2 Cor 11:7-9! — 16:30, 14 August 2009 (UTC)

Challenge re: 1 Tim 5:17

Cline challenged me in a blog comment to give reason and sources for interpreting 1 Tim 5:17 the way I do. Here’s what I’ve found so far:

Adam Clarke Commentary, in its section on 1 Tim 5:17-18, states:

Double honour: διπλῆς τιμῆς. Almost every critic of note allows that τιμῆ here signifies reward, stipend, wages. Let him have a double or a larger salary who rules well; and why? Because in the discharge of his office he must be at expense, in proportion to his diligence, in visiting and relieving the sick, in lodging and providing for strangers; in a word, in his being given to hospitality, which was required of every bishop or presbyter. . . . The Scripture saith, Thou shalt not muzzle the ox: This is a manifest proof that by τιμῆ, honour, in the preceding verse, the apostle means salary or wages: “Let the elders that rule well be accounted worthy of double honour,” a larger salary than any of the official widows mentioned before, for “the labourer is worthy of his hire.” The maintenance of every man in the Church should be in proportion to his own labour, and the necessities of his family. [1]

Baker’s Evangelical Dictionary of Biblical Theology, in its section on wages, states:

In the epistles Paul stresses the importance of wages. Practically, he argues that those who minister the gospel are entitled to a monetary payment, just as people are paid for work done in the secular sphere (1 Cor 9:7). He himself received similar support on occasion (2 Cor 11:8). Teaching elders in the churches are to be paid since “the worker deserves his wages” (1 Tim 5:17-18). [2]

Matthew Henry Complete Commentary, in its section on 1 Tim 5:17, states:

Concerning the supporting of ministers. Care must be taken that they be honourably maintained (1 Timothy 5:17): Let the elders that rule well be counted worthy of double honour (that is, of double maintenance, double to what they have had, or to what others have), especially those who labour in the word and doctrine, those who are more laborious than others. . . . He quotes a Scripture to confirm this command concerning the maintenance of ministers that we might think foreign; but it intimates what a significancy there was in many of the laws of Moses, and particularly in this, Thou shalt not muzzle the ox that treads out the corn, Deuteronomy 25:4. The beasts that were employed in treading out the corn (for that way they took instead of threshing it) were allowed to feed while they did the work, so that the more work they did the more food they had; therefore let the elders that labour in the word and doctrine be well provided for; for the labourer is worthy of his reward (Matthew 10:10), and there is all the reason in the world that he should have it. We hence learn, (1) God, both under the law, and now under the gospel, has taken care that his ministers be well provided for. Does God take care for oxen, and will he not take care of his own servants? The ox only treads out the corn of which they make the bread that perishes; but ministers break the bread of life which endures for ever. (2) The comfortable subsistence of ministers, as it is God’s appointment that those who preach the gospel should live of the gospel (1 Corinthians 9:14), so it is their just due, as much as the reward of the labourer; and those who would have ministers starved, or not comfortably provided for, God will require it of them another day. [3]

— 17:04, 14 August 2009 (UTC)

According to StudyLight.org, the definition of τιμῆ is:

1. a valuing by which the price is fixed
   1. of the price itself
   2. of the price paid or received for a person or thing bought or sold
2. honour which belongs or is shown to one
   1. of the honour which one has by reason of rank and state of office which he holds
   2. deference, reverence

And it is translated thusly:

KJV (45) — honour, 35; precious, 1; price, 8; sum, 1;
NAS (41) — honor, 28; honorable use, 1; marks of respect, 1; precious value, 1; price, 7; proceeds, 1; sum, 1; value, 1;

So, since it is translated as “price” or “sum” 9 times in the KJV, and as “value”, “price”, “proceeds”, “sum”, or “value” 11 times in the NASB, I’m not “setting a precedent in Greek Lit.” as Cline posits. — 17:19, 14 August 2009 (UTC)

The nine instances where τιμῆ is translated as “price” or “sum” in the KJV are Mt 27:6, 9; Acts 4:34; 5:2, 3; 7:16; 19:19; 1 Cor 6:20; 7:23. — 17:34, 14 August 2009 (UTC)